Comments on: Lost in Space or Thrown Away? – Revisiting the 2009 Augustine Committee Report http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/ Fri, 03 Aug 2018 06:04:06 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.9.8 By: Andrew Swallow http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5764 Tue, 11 Oct 2016 05:45:28 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5764 Mars One is a different project.

Video about the Single Person Spacecraft.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bysvILy5Mck

They were still working on this project in August. I do not know the level of funding.

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By: billgamesh http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5763 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 23:27:55 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5763 I would add that calculations from Project Orion indicate less than 3000 pulse units would take a spaceship to the outer solar system and back. Since adding a few tablespoons of deuterium and/or tritium to these devices effectively multiplies their yield this means the number stays the same no matter how large the ship. In other words, it is the need to keep the G forces within human physiological limits that dictate the number of bombs and not the mass of the spaceship.

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By: billgamesh http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5762 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 23:18:33 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5762 What would be astonishing to the public if presented to them is this simple truth: a titanium disc a thousand feet or so in diameter is a real-honest-to-God flying saucer. Such a monolithic construct forged on the Moon would be able to utilize directional H-bombs and effect Isp numbers in the tens of thousands. Such spaceships could take sizeable crews to the gas giants in the same time frames that chemical rockets take to go to Mars. In other words, the entire solar system, including dozens of ocean moons, would be within range of human missions. We certainly have enough bomb material and with the SLS Launch Abort System a large number of bomb pits, packaged to survive a launch anomaly, could be sent directly to the Moon on each mission.

It sounds like science fiction but is a case of truth being far stranger than fiction. Ask Freeman Dyson.

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By: billgamesh http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5761 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 23:00:53 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5761 Mr. 14 Feet of Ice Are Mandatory will have the last word I think.

https://www.cnet.com/news/trip-to-mars-brain-damage-space-x-elon-musk-university-of-california-irvine/

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By: billgamesh http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5760 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 22:53:35 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5760 I am afraid the reality is your NewSpace Orwellian “bright side” is the worst thing that has ever happened to space exploration. The booster I am referring to goes back to 1972 and is a far different creature than anything the hobbyists are pursuing.
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=19720015131

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By: Ben http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5758 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:26:20 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5758 Indeed.

Of course, a SpaceX fanboy could simply read that as SpaceX has decided that they want 20% more profit on the reused flights.

Or a more measured reading could be:
SpaceX may still be targeting a 30% cost reduction, but they aren’t there yet. Currently a 10% cost reduction is feasible.

Or as you say:
SpaceX has determined that it isn’t as easy to reuse the boosters as they thought.

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By: Ben http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5757 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 20:18:56 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5757 You are correct. I skipped lines in the table. I was referring to Columbia.

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By: Joe http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5756 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 17:54:22 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5756 Hi Ben,

As we are discussing SpaceX economics here is an interesting point.

SpaceX’s Shotwell has previously stated that attempted recovery of the Falcon 9 first stage requires a 30% reduction in payload capacity and (in a separate statement of course) the savings for reuse would also be 30%. As I have mentioned before that is pretty much a wash.

Now, however, that appears to be changing.

The payload hit would seem to be the same (she announced no changes) but, you will find (well down in the article) that the stated savings from reuse have now been reduced to 10%.

http://spacenews.com/spacexs-shotwell-on-falcon-9-inquiry-discounts-for-reused-rockets-and-silicon-valleys-test-and-fail-ethos/

“What is your current thinking on the savings for customers using a reused Falcon 9 first stage? Is a 30 percent discount realistic?

We are not decreasing the price by 30 percent right now for recovered and reused vehicles. We’re offering about a 10 percent price reduction.”

Reality of what it will take to refurbish a Falcon 9 first stage appears to be sinking in on Shotwell. Wonder if it ever will on Musk.

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By: Grand Lunar http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5755 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 16:30:20 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5755 “Before Discovery’s loss, the Shuttle was flying 5-8 times per year and there is no apparent link between the number of flights and the yearly program cost.”

I think you mean Challenger’s loss.

Otherwise, the other loss was Columbia.

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By: James http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/lost-in-space-or-thrown-away-revisiting-the-2009-augustine-committee-report/#comment-5754 Mon, 10 Oct 2016 14:58:26 +0000 http://spudislunarresources.nss.org/blog/?p=1500#comment-5754 I know where we can get some pulse propulsion material. And the sooner we ship it all to the Moon and start building an Orion nuclear pulse spaceship there, the happier a lot folks, including me, will be.

“The International Panel on Fissile Materials, at Princeton University, estimates the stockpiles of weapons-grade plutonium at 88 metric tons for the United States and 128 metric tons for Russia. To give you a sense of how much plutonium that is, it is an unclassified fact that a nuclear weapon can be made with as little as 4 kilograms of plutonium. It’s a slightly touchier subject that this is the average in the U.S. stockpile — one can make do with less. But let’s do the math: Even at 4 kilograms per nuclear weapon, 88 metric tons represents enough material for 22,000 nuclear weapons.

One hundred and twenty-eight metric tons is enough for 32,000 nuclear weapons.”

From: ‘The United States and Russia Are Prepping for Doomsday’
October 8, 2016
At: https://www.yahoo.com/news/united-states-russia-prepping-doomsday-165806407.html

So, 22,000 and 32,000 equals 54,000 pulses…

That should be enough to get a large Orion pulse ship to Ceres and back several times.

Or pick some other useful destination or destinations.

If we are wise, the plutonium would become available.

Let’s be wise and put it to good use.

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